For competition shooting, you are most likely going to turn to hand loaded rounds, but for the five factory loads we have looked at, we would go with the 139gr Hornady Superformance SST round. Below we have listed the rounds we will be using for comparison. The first is obvious that both of these cartridges feature near equivalent sectional densities. And we will go ahead and state now that we do not believe any one of the three components we will look at are the perfect indicator for how well any of these rounds are going to bring down game. Below, we will look at a larger sample size which should give us a better idea of how these two cartridges compare in their ballistic coefficients. The 7mm-08 case is just slightly longer than the parent .308—2.035 inches vs. 2.015 inches—but maintains the same 20-degree shoulder of the .308 Winchester. (160 Sp at 3050).475 +2.5" +2.3" 3"@145: 301: 7x61 S&H (154 SP at 3060).433 +2.5" +2.3" 3"@150: 300: 7mm Rem. The lighter 150-grain loads make a sound choice for deer and antelope hunters, and for those who want to take their .308 for heavier game like moose, elk and bear, there are a good number of 180- and 200-grain loads to choose from. And perhaps the biggest piece of the puzzle is how good a shot you are. 7mm-08 Remington Back in 1958, a certain 7mm/308 Winchester wildcat round was brought into development as its name hints, people developed this round by just necking down a standard .308 Winchester to have .284 bullets (7mm). Best Concealed Carry Insurance [Comparison Chart]. Due to the shoulder safety design, the neck is very short. All of these categories including the categories outside of ballistics all go hand in hand and influence each other. The difference between these two cartridges is going to come down to a couple of simple questions. The main reason for sticking with these three is because the numbers that are generated are better for comparing two cartridges rather than individual rounds where something like ballistic gels would be very useful. The open class can be very intimidating to a new shooter as this is where the deep pockets and also the best shooters tend to play. Inside of 200 yards no advantage. This round has a great BC for .308 rounds (.45), and when paired with the velocity and long-range trajectory, you have an excellent round for precision shooting. Other situations might not require that high of bullet momentum to be effective. I am familiar w/ a regular .270 ( I have a Rem 700BDL and a Savage). Mag. So, let’s take a look at the ten rounds we have selected and see if there is any difference in ballistic coefficients between the two cartridges (Graph 3). Get our PDF with 13 pistol & rifle targets (worth $48) including expert instructions for FREE! When we take into account a lot more rounds, we see that the results from our small sample size were not indicative of the two cartridges. This round is affordable which is an important consideration when you plan burning through quite a few out on the range. vs. .458 Lott• 7mm Rem. Both are great rounds for medium to large game at short ranges. All the way out to 500 yards, there is less than four inches of difference or less. It’s a great medium to large game cartridge and can be used for just about any large game animal in the world under the right conditions. I dont know if the WSM offers that much more ballistic performance over the standard 270 to justify the extra recoil the magnum puts out. Take this with a grain of salt, as there are .308 rounds out there that have the same or better performance specs in this category. In the case of these two cartridges, the choices top out at 175 grains in 7mm and 200 grains in .30; I suppose the decision could come down to whether or not you intend to use the heaviest bullets for the respective calibers, and use them routinely. THE BEST GUN DEALS AND HANDPICKED GEAR RECOMMENDATIONS, Subscribe to our Newsletter and we send you the best deals right into your inbox. Your firearm, as well as the specific type of round, also play a large role. There is not a big enough difference to pick one over the other based on penetration alone. All of these rounds have well over 1,500ft.lb of force at the 200-yard mark, and some of them still carry this amount of force out to 300 yards. The… As we have mentioned before, and are bound to mention again before the article is over, these two cartridges are very similar. Comparing the 139/140 grain bullet of the 7mm-08 and the 150 grain bullet of the .308, there's less than 2 inches difference in trajectory out to 400 yards. 28 Nosler Brass.280 Remington Brass.280 Ackley Improved Brass When we look at the rate of velocity loss between these two cartridges, they are almost identical. The bullet energy is the highest of the selected .308 rounds with 1,300ft.lbs of energy at the 500-yard mark which is enough for even larger game at that range. It might be enough to persuade some users to choice one over the other, but for most, the ballistics and other performance specs are going to carry more weight. Momentum is simply how well an object in motion can stay in motion. The .308 with correct other equipment puts you in the F-T/R class with a weight limit of approx. This data was compiled from the manufacturer (Graph 7). To give you some piece of mind that our sample size is a better representation of the full complement of these cartridges, we will also present the averages of twenty rounds for each cartridge at the end of each section. From these numbers, we do see a slight advantage for the 7mm-08 Remington. Mag.• .30-06 Springfield vs. .270 Winchester• 6.5 Creedmoor vs. 7mm-08 Remington• 8x57 Mauser vs. .318 Westley Richards• .358 Winchester vs. .350 Remington Magnum• .22-250 Remington vs. .220 Swift• .270 Winchester vs. .270 WSM• .26 Nosler vs. 6.5-300 Weatherby Magnum• .458 Win. Think 7mm-08 Rem/.308 Winchester, .280 Remington/.30-06 Springfield, 7mm Remington Magnum/.300 Winchester Magnum, 7mm RUM/.300 RUM. It has a rebated rim, bottleneck casing with a 1:9.5 twist on a large rifle magnum primer. Say I've got a 7mm WSM Kimber Montana and a .30-06 fwt in McMillan stock (I do). When looking at the average velocities for these rounds, we see the same general trends as we did above. The case is based off a .300 WSM with a narrowed neck to fit .284 inch bullets on a .321 inch neck and the parent case is the .404 Jeffery. There was a slight advantage for the 7mm-08 rounds which might bring them up in potential penetration and make up a little for the lack of momentum. When deciding between cartridges, recoil is often a major factor that a lot of shooters take into account. While it is true that .308 inch bullets are used in both cartridges, the .300 Win Mag is more suited for shooters using heavier bullets (200-220 grain range). Nothing personal against the 308 Winchester. With this information, we are better able to draw conclusions as to which scenarios each of these cartridges will be better suited for use in specific shooting scenarios. With proper shot placement, this round still has the energy and the velocity for proper terminal ballistics and making a clean kill. And again, there are quite a few rounds from both cartridges that overlap in velocities and the differences between the averages wouldn’t be significant from a statistical standpoint. With that being said, there are .308 rounds that outperform some 7mm-08 rounds in flat trajectory. I’ll be primarily writing this article in mind of new hunters looking at rifles chambered in each of these cartridges, […] Still. Now, six inches can be a pretty big difference when the buck of a lifetime is in the crosshairs, but overall, these cartridges perform analogously in short range trajectory. When these factors can be minimized, the bullets remain on their desired path, and you get a more accurate shot. At the end of these cartridge comparisons, we like to take a look at the ten rounds we have been using throughout the article and pick a couple of rounds from each cartridge that we think would suit specific shooting applications. Mag.• .404 Jeffery vs. .416 Rigby• .243 Winchester vs. 6mm Creedmoor• .300 PRC vs. .300 Win. I was most always hunting Deer when the Elk showed up. If we compare these rounds from the two cartridges in the short range, zeroed in at 100 yards. There is a great deal of difference between the 300 Winchester Magnum, affectionately known as the “300 Win Mag”, and the 308 Winchester. The majority is taken directly from the manufacturer, and other data points have been generated by us through trusted ballistic calculators. What was the main appeal of the 7mm at the time? Still, we can make some assumptions about accuracy based on some of the data we have already looked at, and we can discuss that here. Again, it’s not big enough difference seen across the board to make a lot of assumptions about which cartridge has deeper penetration. The 140-grain loads—the most popular among the factory loads for the 7mm-08—leave the muzzle at right around 2800 fps, and with a 200-yard zero, will drop 8 inches at 300 yards, and 24 inches at 400 yards. Recoil can also play a role in accuracy. And while it might not be as ubiquitous in these circles as it once was, the fact that it is still around in modern tactical units is a strapping commendation for the cartridge. Many target shooters found this to be detrimental to extreme accuracy. It seems to depend heavily on the individual round rather than the type of cartridge, similar to what we observed with the velocity of these two cartridges. We seem from these averages that the .308 Winchester rounds carry an average of 9 down to five more lbs/ft.s more momentum than the 7mm-08 Remington rounds. For some medium to large game hunting, there are often shots that are going to be taken at 300+ yards, so understanding how these cartridges perform at this range is important for your cartridge consideration. This is another excellent option for medium to larger game. Even out at 700 yards, there is only 12 inches of difference. The velocity of a bullet is an important factor when deciding on which cartridge you want to take out into the field. Higher sectional densities let us know that the bullet will be able to penetrate deeper. As we discussed above, while the .308 consistently produces more recoil energy, we can’t say if it’s enough to sway you in the direction of either cartridge. For instance, the 140gr 7mm-08 rounds have the same sectional density as the 165gr .308 round. BONUS OFFER: Get your 500 Page Ammo Comparison Handbook (worth $43) for FREE right into your inbox. Tactical marksmen might want more momentum as that is an indicator for passing through obstructions or armor. This number comes from a calculation using a bullet’s weight and diameter. The 7mm Winchester Short Magnum (also known as the 7mm WSM) is a centrefire cartridge developed in partnership with Browning Arms Company and Winchester ammunition, making its debut and introduced to the shooting public in 2001. What we will see is that when looking at ballistic performance between the 7mm-08 vs .308, there are a lot of similarities with some slight differences. With more samples, we actually see the .308 Winchester has a higher ballistic coefficient on average. The 7mm-08 provides an excellent hunting cartridge for medium to large game. For those who might not be familiar with why we want to know when a bullet falls below supersonic speeds, it is because the bullet becomes more destabilized when the sound wave it left behind catches up to it. You can see the similarity in trajectory with the 165-grain .308 load, as both the 140-grain 7mm bullet and 165-grain .308-inch bullet share the same sectional density at .248. For the 7mm-08 vs .308, there is not a whole lot of differences in their applications. Velocity. Both of these cartridges are great short range hunting rounds for medium to larger size game. vs. .300 WSM• .223 Remington vs. .22-250 Remington, E-mail your comments/questions about this site to: EmediaHunter@nrahq.org, For questions/comments about American Hunter magazine, please e-mail:Publications@nrahq.org, You can contact the NRA via phone at: NRA Member Programs1-800-672-3888, To advertise on American Hunter, visit nramediakit.com for more information. With 18ft.lb or recoil energy, you can shoot all day with some gun support at the range without getting fatigued. It shows slightly less bullet drop than the .308 Winchester from a half inch at 200 yards to 2.8 inches at 400 yards. One was bred for war, and the other was a target cartridge, but both serve the hunter well, especially as an all-around rifle. (The 7mm WSM has 81.0 grains of capacity vs. 73.6 grains for the 7mm SAUM.) Like most of the ballistic properties we have looked at between these two cartridges, there is not much of a difference between the price either. The .308 Winchester was introduced by Winchester in 1952 where it quickly became a staple in the American hunting world. Whichever round you choose there is only a little over 6ft.lb of energy between the two cartridges. And again, these are just averages, but if you are wanting a round with the more kinetic energy, there are going to be more options in the upper end of the energy range with the .308 Win. With a degree in Microbiology and several years of doctoral work manipulating bacterial genes, he attempts to merge the rational and unbiased thinking of scientific research with the passions of hunting and fishing. It’s Comparison Time – The 7mm Rem Mag vs 300 Win Mag Even so, it has a variety of bullet weights, mostly within the 120-150grain weight although there are heavier rounds available that are closer to the common hunting rounds of the .308. When we bring in more rounds, the average follows the same trend we saw with the previous set of rounds. It's just that the 7mm-08 Remington a more ballistically efficient cartridge.Perhaps I should apologize for pointing this out so often (like in this blog. But, as we saw when looking at the smaller sample sizes that we graphed, there are flat shooting options for both cartridges. Still, there is enough difference between these two cartridges to operate in both the same and different niches. Because of the popularity of this cartridge, which comes from its performance, there is a wide variety of ammunition with various bullet weights and designs making it easy to match your ammunition with your intended hunting or shooting scenarios. The rimless case uses a 20-degree shoulder for headspacing, and has a neck measuring 0.303-inch, or just short of one caliber, sufficient to hold bullets in place without needing a heavy roll crimp. The 7mm WSM d… Let’s zoom back out a few hundred yards and look at the long-range trajectory of the 7mm-08 vs .308. Please note, the following information reflects the estimated average ballistics for each caliber and does not pertain to a particular manufact With that being said, both of these cartridges produce enough recoil to affect the accuracy of a shot, and especially quick follow up shots. The 175 grain bullet worked well on Elk and caribou for me. Tackling the latter question first, I can report that there is a noticeable difference in felt recoil between the two—not enough to make me think twice about it, but it is there. The 7mm-08 on average does show a little more than an inch less bullet drop. It is a member of … I’ve got to give it to the .308 Winchester, and only by a hair, because of the wide array of rifles and ammo available just about anywhere. Cause i like how the .308 has a shorter barrel. With a 200-yard zero, a decent spitzer will drop 9 inches at 300 yards and 26 inches at 400 yards, making it a solid contender for an all-around big-game rifle. It has an excellent BC for a hunting round at .421 and only 12 inches of bullet drop at 300 yards when zeroed in at 100 yards. Hi all - I know I'll get several opinions here, but I'm just researching ballistics and calibers for my next rifle purchase. Say I'm going to go elk hunting (I am sometime in the next three years). Tactically, this difference in momentum might be a plus for the .308 Win. About the only way to measure accuracy is to take all of these rounds on the range and measure groupings, but even that method has a lot of variables that can’t be controlled and could easily differ from day to day. It was intended to provide lighter recoil while maintaining heavy enough bullet weight and velocity to effectively reach out and kill game efficiently. A the 600 and 700 yard mark we do see the rounds from the two cartridges begin to space out with the 7mm-08 rounds showing an average bullet drop of 80.6in (600 yards) and 120in (700 yards) compared to an average bullet drop of the .308 rounds of 91.5in (600yards) and 133.7in (700 yards). All of the .308 rounds are generating between 20 and 23.5ft.lbs of recoil energy while the 7mm-08 rounds fall within a … The ability of the bullet of specific cartridge to penetrate into the target is another critical factor in stopping power. The final point may be open for debate, but many shooters feel the .300 Win Mag has a slight edge when it comes to accuracy. This is a great round for medium to large game with the AccuBond bullet providing deep penetration. One method used to compare a cartridges penetration is to use the sectional density of the bullets. Even looking at the two rounds with the largest difference, it’s still only six inches. Mag.• .243 Winchester vs. 6mm Remington• 7x57mm Mauser vs. 7mm-08 Remington• .25-06 Remington vs. .257 Weatherby Magnum• .338 Winchester vs. .375 H&H Magnum• .30-30 Winchester vs. .35 Remington• .257 Roberts vs. .250-3000 Savage• .270 Winchester vs. .280 Remington• .35 Whelen vs. 9.3x62mm Mauser• .416 Rigby vs. .416 Remington Magnum• .308 Winchester vs. .30-06 Springfield• .22 Nosler vs. .224 Valkyrie• .300 Win. The full list of rounds can be found at the end of the article. Anyway, reason the 6.5-284 boys go long action is Bullet Length. At the 200 yard mark, all of the rounds are within three inches of each other, and the averages between the two (3.68 for the 7mm-08 and 4.03 for the .308) are less than half an inch. We do see that it is the .308 rounds that carry the most energy, but there are 7mm-08 rounds such as the Hornady SST that carries more energy than several .308 rounds. So just from the numbers, the .308 Win might seem like a better choice in these situations but it’s by no means a runaway favorite. Normally, the manufacturer will provide the amount of velocity needed. The more the bullet drops, the bigger the adjustments will need to be made to make an effective shot and the harder it is to be accurate on a consistent basis without a lot of od practice. Always. Mag. As we move through these sections, we have also added all of the average tables we have used throughout the article below for quick viewing. 270 wsm brass 280 remington 30 carbine unprocessed 30 nosler brass 30-06 federal headstamp ... .308/7.62x51 lake city long range brass 32 win spl brass 325 wsm brass 338 marlin brass ... 7mm mag federal headstamp 7mm mag hornady headstamp 7mm mag nickel The bullet diameter is .308 inches or 7.8mm, and the case length is 2.015 inches or 51.18mm. This is a big draw to the 7mm-08, better trajectories and the same amount of stopping power and penetration are big selling points. 7mm rem mag vs. .308 ? Using the same .473-inch case head diameter of the Springfield (which in turn was borrowed from the 8x57mm Mauser, the Patrone 88 design), the .308 Winchester uses a case measuring 2.015 inches, in comparison to the Springfield’s 2.494 inches. In this article, we are not going to argue for one cartridge over the other but look objectively at the differences between these rounds in various performance categories. Again, we do not see any clear trends between the two cartridges even out to the 500-yard mark. The same principles go for hunters who might want more momentum if they are hunting game with thick hide and bones but still need a round that is going to pass through. These numbers might differ from numbers generated by other people through chronographs or other physical means through their gun platform. Recoil is something you have to deal with regardless of the cartridge, but the severity of the “kick” depends on what you are shooting. Fantastic ballistic performance, a touch less recoil and no need for 30cal Heavies which drive a bunch of recoil in a … Now, these results might not hold up when we look at a lot more rounds added into the equation and is what we see when we look at our larger sample size in the table below. According to the load manuals, the 7mm WSM offered a bit more velocity than the 7mm SAUM. by Philip Massaro - I was all set on a .308 or a .300 WM when I came across the .270 WSM. When the variables are put into an equation, and we get the BC, a higher number tells us that the bullet has lower air drag, can resist crosswinds, and is less prone to wind drift than a bullet with a lower BC. If we look a bit closer, we still see that all of the rounds fall within four and a half inches of each other. Violate this principle by, for example, chambering a lightweight, short action rifle for a powerful Magnum cartridge like the .300 WSM and the result will be a dramatic increase in kick. Regardless, more recoil energy from one round to the next often translates loosely to more kick. For the .308 Win, we like the Nosler Ballistic Tip 165gr. Not only does it give us some insights into how these two cartridges might behave, but we also have a sense of why they are similar or different when we look at the various ballistic and other performance characteristics. Finally, if both are zeroed for 125 yards, the 270 WSM will hit 2.5 inches low at 300 yards while the 308 will hit 4 inches low. When you buy through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission. It’s also important to realize that if we added twenty more rounds each, we might see the gap shrink even smaller or maybe flip. Because of that, we would expect both to drop below supersonic speeds at around the same distance, which is what we see with these averages. The WSM is about the same as the long 7 mag, and they are both sharper and harder than a 30-06, but not enough to really bother you. So, with all of that out of the way, let’s start digging into how the 7mm-08 vs .308 cartridges compare and contrast to each other. We've got you covered.• 6.5 Creedmoor vs. .260 Remington• .303 British vs. 8x57 Mauser• .30-06 Springfield vs. All Other .30s• .17 HMR vs. .17 WSM• .450 Nitro Express vs. .470 Nitro Express• 350 Legend vs. .35 Remington• .280 Ackley Improved vs. 7mm Rem. And though we are only going to graph ten rounds, we compiled a lot more than that. In 2004 I took my 99 .270 WSM and a light .375 H&H. And we know for a fact that there will be some of you out there who have taken big game with 7mm-08 rounds. Again, a lot depends on the round you are using rather than the cartridge. On average, the 7mm-08 rounds have a higher velocity from the muzzle out to 500 yards, but there are several .308 rounds that perform as well as the 7mm-08. And if you look at the equation for momentum, it makes sense that these rounds generate a fair amount more momentum than the lighter 7mm-08 Remington rounds. Shop Nosler Products. And as we say a couple times through this article, you’re not shooting averages out in the field, but if a flatter trajectory is the main factor you are basing your decision on, the averages show that there will be more options with slightly flatter trajectories for the 7mm-08 Rem. While there doesn’t appear to be much of a gap between these two cartridges when looking at these selected rounds, let’s take a look at the averages when we add in some more rounds for each cartridge. Deep penetration is not always wanted for every situation, but for larger game with thick tissue and bones, you need deep penetration to reach and damage vital organs. If you are into long range shooting or most of your shooting comes from on the range, you might lean towards the 7mm-08 just because of the decreased recoil and the slight advantage in trajectory. And as we saw with the energy comparison. With comparable muzzle velocities (the 7mm-08 is a bit faster with the 140-grain load) the difference in holdover is negligible. More momentum is not always what you need, it’s really going to depend on what the scenario is. It was devised by necking down the .308 Winchester caliber’s neck, in order for the overall bullet to have a smaller diameter. Both are are easy to shoot, can be housed in easy-to-carry, lightweight rifles and neither cartridge requires a country mile of barrel length to get the best performance. The 7mm-08 gives better ballistic coefficient and sectional density values when comparing bullets of the same weight, the .308 will offer a greater frontal diameter. And there are still 7mm-08 rounds that have more similar momentum numbers than others, the .308 Win cartridge is, more often than not, going to provide more bullet momentum which is something we will discuss in the applications section. We have listed the price for 20 rounds of our selected ammunition used in this article for comparison. Let’s take a look at the average velocity for each of the cartridges when we bring in more factory loads. Both have their place in the hunting and competitive shooting world, and we will come out front stating that both can easily become your top cartridge choice when in the field under the right conditions. It stayed a wildcat for over two decades until Remington—long famous for adopting wildcat cartridges like the .257 Roberts, .22-250 Remington, .25-06 Remington and .35 Whelen—made an honest cartridge out of the 7mm/308; in 1980, the 7mm-08 Remington saw the light of day. On average, both are dropping to subsonic speeds right at 1,000 yards. When the bullets are forced downrange by the lit powder, they carry kinetic energy that is generated by the energy from the ignited powder and the mass of the bullet. We do see the average KE for the .308 Win rounds increase slightly compared to our smaller sample size. Plus it's a heck of alot cheaper to shoot which could mean more practice at the range and easier on the shoulder. Just from looking at the casing and overall cartridge specs we can begin to garner some information about the .270 vs .308. Gonna shoot 143smk and up in your 6.5-284 you gotta go long action. Basically, Remington intended the caliber to be able to provide lesser recoil than a .308 while still being large and powerful enough to kill wild North American game effectively at long distances. From ranges within 500 yards, there is less than 4 inches of difference between the averages at 500 yards and even less as you move down to the zero mark. What is a better cartridge for elk and deer at about 500 yards. Like the short range trajectory, we are looking at the bullet drop in inches of these ten rounds. While we don’t think that the price of ammunition should be the sole deciding factor when choosing between two cartridges, it does play a role for a lot of us. Lastly what is the max range for each. These numbers were calculated with normal, sea-level environmental conditions which means these numbers can change depending on where and when you are shooting. And you still have to take into account the design of the bullet. The 7mm-08 vs .308 argument is a newer one, relative to some other cartridge arguments that have now been raging for nearly a century, in the hunting and shooting world, as the 7mm-08 was introduced in the 1980’s. Looking for previous installments of our "Head to Head" series? The .308 Winchester was released as a sporting cartridge before it was officially adopted as a military round; the comparisons between the new, shorter case and the .30-06 Springfield were immediate, and continue to this day. Shot placement is equally if not more important than the amount of energy that the bullet is carrying. The 7mm-08 was derived from necking down the neck of the .308 Win and allowed it to accept the smaller diameter 7mm bullet. When discussing the 7mm-08 vs .308, we have to split hairs to find significant differences in the cartridges’ ballistic performances. For hunting purposes, the extra momentum might give you a little piece of mind if you’re hunting bigger where you really need something to pass cleanly through the animal. Let’s zoom in on sections of this total range with several different rounds for each cartridge and see if any differences are more noticeable. 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